Hey Scotty, I am looking for an affordable, fast, sports car. It must be, reliable, fast, have 6 or more cylinders, weigh under 3525 lbs preferably under 3200 lbs, fun, reasonably practical, handle like its on rails, be reasonably comfortable to drive daily, and make a good sound. These are just some cars I have found to hit these expectations: BMW M2 2016 vs BMW M240i 2017 vs Porsche Caymen S 981 2013. Also I want to know which costs more to maintain between them and specifically the M2 vs M240, I know the Caymen will cost a bit. I know many of you think I am making a mistake looking at these cars but they are the only ones that fit my parameters. If any of you know of any other cars that fit these parameters PLEASE tell me what it is, I have been looking long and hard and this is what I have come up with, any help is appreciated. I will be buying one on these cars when I get my license and build up enough money to buy one reasonably comfortably. I should have about 15k to spend then(2 years from now) so keep that in mind they may on average be over that cost in 2 years but I hopefully will be able to negotiate down close to $15K. Thanks!
And I forgot it must be rwd or rear biased awd.
$15K for those cars?? Realize for the cars you listed, the buying price is going to be much much higher than the budget you listed, even in 2 years - probably in the $30K-$40K range at the very least. Maybe a really high mileage M240i will creep around $20K if you're lucky. Also, buying cost is just one part of the equation - you also have to account for expensive routine maintenance and repairs, high parts costs, and pricey insurance on.
If you want a reliable sports/performance car for around $15K, you may be able to get a higher mileage C5 Chevrolet Corvette Z06 but that's still stretching it. Honestly, for the budget you stated you're much better off going with something like a Honda Civic Si or an older Subaru WRX manual - you will easily be able to get these within your stated price range and they will be reliable with easy maintenance.
I see BMW M235i 2015 around for $15-$20k with mileage in the 70-80k range and that is now when car prices are inflated. I think the M240 the M235's successor will be similar in price. Like I said I believe I could negotiate for $15k or below on that pretty easily. Once this inflated car cost period subsides hopefully costs go down the M2 will hopefully be cheaper because the new redesigned model is set to come out next year for both the M2 and M240i so that will further my chances of getting them cheap. BMW's and Porsche Depreciate! The porsche will maybe be stretching things but I might as well ask because who knows! Thanks for the advice on the C5 corvette how reliable is it and if I bought one with 100k miles on it would I be able to get another 100k out of it with not too much money spent in repairs, I like the idea of a corvette but worry about an old GM and it's reliability but maybe that is all in my head. If I couldn't get any that I listed I would the move to an IS or GS 350 from around 2016. If that doesn't work then go civic si. If you know of any other cars that come close to the guidelines I set for the car I want please let me know because I have been looking around alot.
Another car that seems to fit now that I look is the nissan 370z, but it is only a 2 seater and isn't that practical.
Stay away from BMW at that mileage. Even if you can buy it cheap, I can promise you it certainly will not be cheap to own - especially if you are going to put on a lot of miles. The Lexus models you referenced are great cars. I would also consider a 1st gen Lexus IS300 - they are RWD, practical, sound great, have the really cool Supra-derived 2JZ-GE engine, and are extremely reliable/dependable as daily drivers. Plus, you can easily get them in great condition for about half of the price you mentioned, and you will likely get a really good insurance price on these since they're older cars.
I have consider them but Lexus automatic Trannys just don't seem to know what gear to be in. I am generally skeptical of BMW reliability but in this case, with the B58 Supra engine and ZF 8 speed tranny, I feel a little different. Like I said time will tell but in a couple of years the B58 engine and other BMW's with them will be 8 years old so I may have a decent idea of reliability. I plan to get this BMW with around 50k miles on it not 80k that was just to prove a point. But I believe that if I and the previous owner did regular maintenance that it could last 200k or more miles. I may have to repair a few things but nothing too major. It sound like a reliable car but I am leaving my options open. That 2jz is appealing though!
Ok, so I've read your question and the answers provided so far...
Right off the bat, $15k for ANY of those cars will not cut it. They are WAY out of your price range. You stated that the M240i was around $15k with 70k miles...I would not buy any BMW with that kind of mileage, ESPECIALLY a performance oriented one. I guarantee the person(s) who owned the car previously drove it very hard to its full potential. They may have gone a step further and tuned the car for extra power (very common practice on BMWs), which in turn wears the engine out faster than normal. Not too much life left on a BMW with 70k miles.
The M2 and the Porsche are going to be VERY expensive to maintain, let alone VERY expensive to buy. And if anything breaks on them, it's going to cost a fortune. The Porsche's engine literally needs to be removed just to fix something relating to it...it goes straight to the dealer's service center for any issues. At least the M2 is manageable if you have experience working on engines (if you plan on doing things yourself).
Having said all this, the M240i is the best choice out of your specific list. But does it meet your price range? No. Either you're gonna need to set more money aside, or you're gonna have to go with something that's in your price range. In my opinion, even a non-performance (not M series) BMW will offer you plenty of power for some fun spirited driving. Heck, you can buy a basic BMW and build it yourself (like me 😁).
They are well out of my price range now. Like I have been saying its predecessor from 2015 can be found under $20k. That is when car prices are inflated. Once these prices go down the you will probably can get the lower than that. And with the redesigned 2 series coming out in a year I expect the old 2 series' value to drop like a rock. If it has been tuned I will probably pass, the B58 can be tuned pretty high around 500 hp and still be reliable. Would the M2 cost more to maintain? I have heard everything from it costs double the M240 to maintain or that it is similar. I do plan to do simpler things myself though. Remember, the B58 in the M240 is overbuilt using a closed deck design and is built off a diesel block so it should be. If it is tuned then I would probably pass unless it had a exhaust or hadn't been tuned a whole lot. The porsche I am not so sure about, I have heard it is reliable but would cost a lot to maintain. I think the B58 with 50 to 60k miles on it could if untuned last me until around 200k miles remember the video Scotty made of the thousand dollar BMW 325i that had 200k and some odd miles on it has the same inline six design and simliar size, it did have a standard transmission which you can get in any of these car but I figure that ZF 8 speed is reliable and good enough. Do you have any other suggestions?
Run as far as you can from all of them. They are endless money pits as they age!
Haha, the M240 from what I have heard is about as reliable as the new Toyota Supra 2020, it has the same engine and Transmission. I have also seen from multiple sources how reliable it is including JD Power, Consumer Reports among others it is basically a newer verision of the BMW 325i from the 90s that Scotty raved about it only being $1000. Similar inline 6 engine but now it has been perfected by using a diesel block and it has a modular closed deck design. It was supposedly made in collaboration with Toyota and went through all the reliability testing all Toyotas do. The transmission has been praised by scotty many times so not too worried there. The M2 is similar but uses the predecessor to the engine in the Supra/M240 the B58, the M2 uses the N55 while it is still a great engine the B58 is better overall IMO. The Caymen, I am unsure about, but from the little I've heard the seem reliable but expensive to repair even in relation to the BMW's. What are the maintenance costs on all of these vehicles compared to one another. Also while you guys are at it what do you all think of the Nissan 370Z Nismo? Thanks!
Just so you know the new Supra - I don’t have high hopes for it’s reliability. I was disappointed Toyota went with BMW engine and ZF transmission.
Time will tell I guess, I do think it was good for BMW, their newer model like within the past five years or so seem more reliable, the transmission was IMO a fine choice but I do think it was too much too use the same engine that BMW uses but like I said I heard the collaborated on the engine. BMW and Toyota also collaborated on the chassis for the Supra. It isn't as bad as a lot of people say it is but it would have been nice if they did it from the ground up like they did with the GR Yaris which sounds like an awesome car. Too bad they aren't bringing it to the USA.
I recommend 2004 Corvette C5, non-Z06. That’s what I have and can tell you they are fairly reliable before GM went downhill.
You can also go for the C5 Z06 but they had valve springs break. Upgrade with Brian Tooley Racing (BTR) springs and should be fine.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kuPxSvKGcGY
I am seriously considering that now but how many more miles do you think out of it if it already had about 100k on it? I believe 2 separate people have them, one a red coupe the other a gray convertible so I could maybe try to ask them what year, model, etc. Any other options because I would PREFER a 2+2 seat coupe but it is not a must the it be a 2+2, but I don't want a convertible.
The Engine can last hundreds of thousands of miles easily with good maintenance. It was a simple push rod V8 with port injection and NO variable valve timing. 6-speed manual was Tremec, and 14 total computer modules (per my scan tool Autel MX808). Some of those modules impossible to get since it’s been 17+ years (2004 last year of that C5 Gen), but I haven’t had to replace any of them yet.
I meant two people who live in my neighborhood.
Just make sure it wasn’t driven like a maniac from prior owners. Being a C5 it might have multiple owners.
So you recommend going for the Z06 if you can get those springs. I think that is what I would do if I got that car. I have always loved corvettes but thought that I would never get the chance to own one. Do you think in a couple years I could get a good deal on one under 15k?
Yeah will definitely have it check out if I get one but I doubt the person in my neighborhood rags on it or anything. I think he is in his 50's but who knows I will definitely have it looked at by a trusted mechanic and myself.
Buying a 5 year old 80k miles BMW for 15 grand seems like you can't afford to not only buy it, but fix it when it falls apart in a couple years. All the choises are all just about to become an endless money pit but are still very expensive. I assume you have considered and not liked the V8 Mustang? It weights 3500 pounds or so. The Mustang would be more reliable than all of those options I am pretty sure but I assume you already considered it.
I was talking about an M235i (the predeccessor to the M240i) I just saw a few online for $15-20k and I think that the M240 would have a similar value in a few years. I have seen more than I can count on two hands $25-30k already and that is with the price of used car being inflated right now. Remember these car depreciate hard the first few years. They will probably depreciate harder when the new M240 and M2 comes out in 2022. I plan to buy a car in the August of 2023. Even though I considered the Mustang the with the V8 but though it was not all that reliable and that it doesn't handle like a sports car. A Mustang is a muscle car not a sports car and I have ruled out Muscle cars just because they don't handle that well; Does the M2 have higher running cost than the M240? I have heard some people say the M2 has M running cost making it more expensive but then I hear others say since it doesn't have an M engine, The N55 instead of the S55 that it is similar. I knew the Caymen probably is more expensive to maintain but just wanted to ask. Are there any other cars that come to your mind?
I honestly don't have much to say about the BMW M series or Porshces other than that they are all good for a few years and then fall apart afterwards.