Hey guys. There is a thing that i dont understand, according to Scotty, Honda and toyota are the best brands and honda makes worlds best engines. Therefore i have these questions for nowadays car 2017-2021:
Do mercedes not make such good engines as honda and toyota? I have seen many mercedes motors run for a long time?
There has been questions about the repair of mercedes alot because of their electrical instruments, but honda and toyota do also consist of alot of electronics?
In general can someone explain why honda/toyota are better than the german cars like mercedes and bmw?
Well there is a lot. Honestly google will tell you if you want to read the plethora of information out there... Also also, DEPENDS ON WHAT YOUR DEFINITION OF BETTER IS.
In short here is just a couple of pointers... I started as a Benz, BMW and porche tech. Drove a couple high end cars, it was pretty cool. Older Benz had good solid engines and transmissions, and the platforms that kept the v8 specifically had excellent stability. Bmw was basically ight until 80k miles where they would be plagued with water pump failers and had many MANY problems with it's Vanos system (basically German's version of honda's v-tec) this is not even mentioning euro tax here in the states. The technology in a Benz vs in a Toyota is non comparable and making that comparison is almost a fallacy. The Germans are not the best when it comes to the quality aspect of their electronics and design, it could be said then that the engineers are not mechanics so they overcomplicate everything. Toyota, Honda on the other hand keep things relatively simple. You also got to keep in mind that you are comparing luxury cars to economy cars. And you're talking in a very very broad sense. Of course all the companies mentioned had their own little problems here and there. It's just that when it comes to reliability in general Toyota Honda are said to be the best. if you look at any current listing especially for the newer cars BMW and Mercedes do not rank in the top 10 in terms of reliability which can be argued that is what most people look for in a vehicle. If you would like to read more then please give it a google, there is so much more than this post if you want more info...
I mean that’s just in the states.
-
In Europe you can get a big diesel that’s going to last you 300k+ miles.
-
Or a small Mercedes that’s basically a fancier version of a Renault.
Like how the CLA shares alot of the major components with the Meganè…
Of course the quality is better in EU, I have no doubts about that, just here state-wise I would not trust it.
We are also talking about economic strategies here. Because Mercedes-Benz and BMW are considered luxurious vehicles, the Germans expect their buyers to purchase new vehicles every 3-5 years to keep their high-class social status. So they throw in technology packages to distinguish newer models from older models.
What about their motors and drive line in general ?
Some of them (meaning powertrain) can be solid and reliable, but, as people all too commonly forget or overlook you have to look at the overall package including electronics. Some of those German vehicles have over 100+ computer modules on board and can act up or give out on you long before the powertrain does - out of warranty, good luck getting them fixed without spending a small fortune. It ruins the whole experience, so it’s best to just lease them and return before the warranty expires. And a lot of the repairs on those German cars (including powertrain) require very high level (and $$$) scan tools and esoteric knowledge - not exactly easy to work on especially for the DIYer. This was done on purpose, btw, to get you to go to the dealer and also get you to trade in for a newer German vehicle.
Thanks for your input. But in general if you compare the diesel motors in mercedes C220d or C300d compated to toyota Rav4 hybrid or honda CRV hybrid then which one would be "best" and why ? In general cars do not have much Horse power as mercedes why is that ?
Toyota and Honda seem to take the whole car into account when deciding how much horsepower to give a car. And with hybrids, the engine horsepower is less because it also has the electric motor to give it an additional boost.
I’m not sure about the latest crop of diesels, but it seems older diesels can last forever.
So by taking the whole car into consideration they make better motors?
I think Toyota and Honda make longer lasting engines than Benz or BMW. Toyota and Honda focus more on quality and use time tested components. Benz and BMA focus on the latest and greatest in engineering. They are amazing machines but may not last as long.
With BMW’s, IMHO, I think the core of the engine is solid and the transmission is solid. It’s the components surrounding the core of the engine that can give your problems, especially the VANOS system. And the valve cover, it’s made of plastic!!!
On top of that, those coils are expensive!!! I mean, they will eventually go out on any car, but to replace them is expensive.
I personally have a love hate relationship with BMW. Amazing vehicles, but expensive to repair/maintain.
{black}:laughingoutloud: {black}:laughingoutloud: Yeah me too man, rly, i love bmw and mercedes from heart, and i really thought about buying one but when i began reading different stuffs about these two brands, and i found it, it was more ''prestige'' than quality then i will just be waiting to get reach some day before buying one {black}:laughingoutloud:
@kaizen
What angers me most about the Vanos system is that it can’t just shut off and set it self to a default valve timing in case of a failure like other VVT systems
-
Even on the Ford TI-VCT if system on cheap cars, when it senses an issue it just uses a metal pin to lock the timing to a default setting so that the car still runs and drives fine.
-
@LMW
to be fully honest, even “less desirable” brands like Volvo or Jaguar get a lot of attention and some of their somewhat reliable models (yes there are jaguars that just last, most don’t) can be gotten for somewhat inexpensively.
(You just gotta know what to avoid and what to look out for)
-
Also Mercedes diesels are pretty good, particularly the OM607 and OM646 can go for 200k miles and 300k miles respectively (if you service them well)
Do you have Facebook bro?
And in Denmark cars are very expensive the state put a charge on cars 160% their price. For instance this car:
https://www.bilbasen.dk/brugt/bil/mercedes/c200-d/22-stc-aut-5d/5120359
cost about 39.638,11 dollars xD
“””Social welfare state””” more like a robbery.
Yeah .. its ekspensive like hell
Yaeah, Dennmark is known to have high taxes. Are they at least used wisely there?
Yeah for sure, free hospital, free school etc etc
btw guys if i buy this car:
https://www.bilbasen.dk/brugt/bil/mercedes/c300-de/20-avantgarde-aut-4d/5018822
And i have mercedes warranty for 2 years, then i shouldn't be concerned about the mechanical and repairs, isnt that right?