I hereby notify that couple weeks ago I finally bought Toyota Auris 2016 with 1.2T engine. Got couple 1.6 engine Corollas in sight too, but they were sold just when I was about to go to see them.

Thank you very much for everyone who participated in this thread, especially @dan for his detailed technical advices on what to aim to and what to definitely avoid.

TLDR:

The best car you named there is a Corolla with a 1.8L with only VVT-i, if you can get it with a manual and low milage.

If no manual 1.8L VVT-i can be found, a 2.0L / 1.6L, Corolla / Auris manual are a strong 2nd place.

Make sure to get it with low milage, cars in Europe last about 200k-250k kilometers.

Corollas tend to be better cars than Golfs / Octavias. not as engaging to drive or sporty, but also special in their own way. From a reliability standpoint - Toyota is just better in 99% of cases.

What's the best Corolla?

The best ever Corolla in Europe was the Corolla E150 but it was only offered in Belgium, Luxembourg and Spain so I wouldn't count on finding one that's 2011-2013 with the 1.6L 1ZR-FE and a manual or a conventional 4/5 speed automatic.

The E170/180 Corolla and Auris both ride on the same "New MC" platform like the old E150 Corolla, but good engine and transmission options in Europe were very limited.

All good engines ended up being paired to mediocre transmissions and the opposite... 

Auris or Corolla?

Many Auris models offered weaker engines than the Corolla alternatives, for example, both the Corolla and Auris offer a 1.8L engine: While the Corolla has a 2ZR-FE with "Dual VVT-i", the Auris offers a 2ZF-FAE with "ValveMatic". Valvematic is a much more troublesome technology than the good old VVT-i that has been around since the mid-90s.

The only thing to know about VVT-i is that if your timing chain ever gets stretched, you might as well replace the VVT-i components while you're at it - other than that, very solid system.

Best engines?

What you want to find ideally is a 1.6L / 1.8L ZR series motor with only VVT-i with conventional automatic - those are hard to find in Europe.

I herd finding a 1.8L only VVT-i with a manual is very hard because, in Europe, Toyota shipped most of them with CVTs as standard.

As far as non-ZR series engines on Corollas, I personally really don't like the smaller 1.2L Turbo with direct gasoline injections is rare and complex, and the 1.33L was an engine that was an ok for a Dihatsu Boon or a Toyota iQ - but on the Corolla they don't last particularly long. As far as the 1.5L - ask owners of Chinese cars, even they aren't very happy with it.

BUT WITH ALL OF THAT BEING SAID - they all usually last to above 200k km with proper maintenance, unlike some VW engines particularly the 1.4L TSI and 1.8 TSI/TFSI those two both are real troublemakers.

Transmissions?

As far as other options, The CVTs are so-so, not terribly unreliable but not that great either - without proper oil changes you begin to hear it whining at 100,000km and that's not a good sign. I guess you can make them last to 220k+ km but they're not great and not sporty (you shouldn't push a CVT too hard).

That being said, those are still better than DSG transmissions - they have a more sporty feel but often you can see them breakdown way earlier.

But overall, you can't go wrong with choosing a manual - those are the most reliable.

Hello!

I suggest you get something with low odometer reading. A petrol car in Europe with 200k km or more has ussualy not much life left.

1.2T and TSI engines are turbocharged. I prefer naturally aspirated ones like 1.33 or 1.6. They will be also the cheapest ones to buy.

Perhaps @dan can tell you more. Check out also his posts about engines above.

Good luck!

@timebelt-travis

Always happy to help.

That one 1.6 VVT-i (1ZR-FE) is one of the best engines out there, If it has low milage I'd choose it - they easy last 300,000km if you replace the oil frequently, don't do short drives and if it was made after 2010.

Probably the best small engine Toyota has built so far, what there is to know about it is: it's built like a tank but isn't very powerful, Timing chains and water pumps can begin to leak / cause noises - and they should be replaced in a timely manner.

Truly a great little engine, just will sometimes it needs a timing chain and VVT-i set around 200k km.

The 1.6 ValveMatic (1ZR-FAE) is slightly worse than it's simpler brother.

ValveMatic (Variable Valve Lift) is a system that's installed in addition to VVT-i (Variable Valve Timing). This system gives a small improvement in torque, horsepower, and better economy - but adds A LOT of complexity to the engine's head.

Unlike Honda's old famous VTEC (Variable Valve Timing & Lift Electronic Control), Toyota's ValveMatic (Continuous Valve Lift Adjustment + Variable Valve Timing with Intelligence) is much more complex in the way it operates. Instead of Honda's ON/OFF valve adjustment - Toyota's is continuous, and according to owners it makes mistakes and had a lot of bugs.

Scotty hasn't talked about VavleMatic because it's rare in the US. As far as I know, The only small engine it was installed on was the Scion iM - and only 50k cars like that were ever sold (It might sound like a lot, but they're very rare compared to over 1.3 million Toyota Corollas sold in the US 2015-2018)

Those engine's are still alright, but the added complexity doesn't do them any favors.

I wouldn't make huge sacrifices to avoid ValveMatic, if you can find VVT-i vs ValveMatic in similar condition then VVT-i would be better, but if there's a significant kilometrage / year / condition difference, the ValveMatic is not that bad. 

1.2T and 1.33 are average engines, better than VW but not great. 

Toyota hybrids are usually good, the issue with them is how the batteries physically age overtime. It might be an interesting experiment but it's definitely a risk, so far no Hybrid I'm aware of lasted over 15 years, but this might change - and it depends on how your climate affects the batteries.

I recommend getting anything as least complex as possible, a 2014 model in 10-15 years will be 18 - 23 years old - so far no Hybrid I saw in my life lasted so long, and things like Turbochargers or complex mechanical components are more likely to fail.

Toyota's CVTs are better then their competition, Nissan's and Subaru's CVTs are failing constantly, a failure on a Toyota is much rarer but they still happen - the first signs are usually whining under load.

But CVTs tend to cause some issues especially for enthusiastic drivers or if they're used in traffic jams.

When you're beginning to move, on a manual the difference between the engine spinning and the wheels not being spun is handled by the clutch slipping (noting inside of the "actual" manual gearbox is slipping),

On a conventional planetary automatic this difference is handled by the torque convertor and in the rest of the gearbox almost nothing slips,

In a CVT, most slippage happens inside of the torque convertor, BUT, because of how it's built the belt is pinched (not held in place like a gear is by a fork, or a part of the planetary gear set with it's teeth) in some driving conditions the belt slips on the cones and wears them out.

As far as DSG, yes most issues are with the DQ200 7 speed dry clutch, Where I live they even had a class action due to some owners having a lot of issues with clutch packs and mechatronics failing. If you do a lot of city driving, these failures are quite common.

Might be different where you live, I live with some of the most dense in the world so DCTs need to slip their clutch much more and that causes more wear.

Their reliability is similar to how Audi's MultiTronic CVT was - great for half owners and terrible to the others. It depends mostly on the driver and if there aren't manufacturing defects.

There's not enough information on VW 1.0L yet.

As far as the 1.2L, a family member of mine has a 1.2L on a Škoda Rapid and it burns litters of oil in between changes. They don't drive much, and yet at ±125,000km they're adding oil on a weekly basis. (oil was replaced at the dealer by the recommended interval of 15,000km [might be different in your country], I guess that if you replace it every 7,500km it'd be better)

But overall, very commutable cars - just questionable transmissions and some oil consumption issues.

Plus modern 1.2L TSI engines have a timing belt so that's additional costs. 

In Europe they probably don't cost too much to maintain, so they can be an option.

As far as that Volvo V40, unlike older S40 models that offered a very reliable Ford DuraTec 1.6L engine, the newer V40 has a Ford EcoBoost 1.6L. The EcoBoost is an engine I'd definitely avoid.

Their attempt to turbocharge a Sigma engine didn't go well. Another engine that's in essence a turbocharged Sigma was the EcoBoost was the 1.5L 4 cylinder EcoBoost. If I'm not mistaken, @ChuckTobias has had one and Ford never managed to get his car to work correctly. If chuck wants to share his experience again that'd be great.

But Volvo T5 engines are usually good, a bit more expensive to maintain than some others but people love them.

It's going to be interesting to see what car you'll end up choosing at the end 🙂

Posted by: @dan

If I'm not mistaken, @ChuckTobias has had one and Ford never managed to get his car to work correctly. If chuck wants to share his experience again that'd be great.

@dan, actually the only Ford I've ever owned was a 1966 Fairlane and that was 50 years ago when I was back in college. I think I've mentioned though that a friend of mine has a Ford Focus with the dual-clutch transmission and after at least three (might even be four) transmission replacements it still isn't right. The car will probably wind up being dumped on Carvana - don't buy from there!

Thanks again for very detailed answer @dan.

Posted by: @dan

It's going to be interesting to see what car you'll end up choosing at the end 🙂

Haha, well yes, feel like having too many options and information in my head already. I guess the biggest obstacle is making compromises between reliability, comfort and silence. Sometimes think that it would be better to throw a dice to see what car to get to end the misery, like

1: Corolla
2: Auris
3-4: Golf
5-6: Octavia

In case of 1-2, a new throw with

1-3: Manual
4-6: Automatic

And that would be it.

Basically I would like to get Toyota Auris/Corolla, but the noisiness is the main obstacle. It depends then how far I am willing to go to get more silent car, without hopefully losing too much of reliability.

So Toyota Auris/Corolla with 1.6 Valvematic, CVT automatic or manual is one option. VW Golf or Skoda Octavia with 1.0 TSI, both manual (probably don't dare to go to DSG's, even if not the dry 7-speed one) would be other options.

Posted by: @dan

There's not enough information on VW 1.0L yet.

I thought 1.0 TSI would have been around for some time already, since 2015, which would give some insight on how it is working. On this 2019 article they evaluate it being better built than previous VAG TSI engines.

https://mlfree.com/en/1-0-tsi-engine-history-problems-experience/

I test drove also one Toyota Avensis T270, they come here mostly with 1.6 (1ZR-FAE) or 1.8 (2ZR-FAE) petrol engines. Was more quiet than Corolla/Auris, but being basically a bit bigger car, would need to get an older model with same budget.

Some models I was offered by a car salespersons when I mentioned of desire to have a more silent/ergonomic car than Octavia/Corolla were:

Audi A3 (Typ 8V) with 1.2 or 1.4 TFSI engine, manual or automatic. I guess it has had good ratings on some noisiness measurements on local car magazine, but as per my understanding it has higher maintenance costs and more expensive parts prone to fail.

Nissan Qashqai (J11) with 1.2 (HR12DDT) engine, manual or automatic. I was a bit surprised that compact SUV would be on the price range. Have never tested one, but have heard their higher profile tires would make them more quiet.

As per my understanding, French cars are not typically known for their reliability especially when they age, but Megane and Laguna (latter one I guess is no longer manufactured) have been praised to be silent cars. Most Renault's sold here in C-segment seem to be Kadjars (compact SUV's) with 1.2 (H5Ft) engine, not sure if that would be silent too.

Hi, @timebelt-travis

The Avensis can be a good option but there's things you should know:

Toyota Avensis Automatic Transmissions:

Personally, I'd avoid the Avensis CVT - and if you want a petrol, it's best to get it as a manual.

Unlike Corollas that got a Aisin K3XX series CVTs, the petrol versions of the Avensis got the Aisin K1XX.

These are often called "A brother to the Jatco JF011" because they're very mechanically similar and their reliability is sadly also similar. The Nissan Jatco JF011 is well known of this forum for all kinds of failures on Nissan cars.

I would AVOID the K1XX series CVT, you might want to ask about their reliability where you live - online you can find a lot of failures at way under 100,000km and less.

But you can not go wrong with a manual. 

those rarely cause any issues, a petrol with a manual can be a good combination.

The diesels are equipped with excellent 6 speed automatic transmissions.

But, the diesel Avensis gets the Aisin U660E - this conventional automatic transmission was also installed on the Lexus ES, Toyota Camry, RAV4, Highlander and even the Lotus Evora. It's a very well built and very popular.

There are some maintenance aspects you want to watch out for (like that these are very sensitive to the brand of transmission fluid that you use) but overall they're very solid transmissions, The only failures I see on those is from people with about 320,000km (200,000 miles) and even those are just repairable hard shifts and not total breakdowns.

Toyota Avensis Engines:

Diesels are of questionable quality

Toyota's diesels are not great at all, the 1.6L Turbo Diesel "1WW" is actually a BMW engine, the same engine that's used in the BMW 1-Series EfficientDynamics (2011 - 2019) and Mini Cooper D and they do not have a great reputation at all, really depends on how familiar are mechanics in your area with this engine.

The other bigger engines, are either stretched versions of the same BMW engine, or an original Toyota design - the AD series seem to have head gasket issue but they do seem to last quite a bit.

Gasoline engines

Pretty much the same ones as on the Corolla, the 1ZR-FAE and 2ZR-FAE are alright - I am not a fan of ValveMatic but other than that, with good service and in the years you mentioned they can last.

The bigger 2.0L 3ZR engine is the same as the small counterparts and it doesn't have any horsepower benefits. It has the same ±150 Horsepower as the 1.8L, it has more torque.

I'm unsure about the Audi it's pretty much just a VW Golf in a fancy suit. The engines they offered both aren't good. no one knows how much it's last maybe 100k km maybe 200k km...

If the mechanics where you live know how to repair them and if you don't mind dealing with the very mediocre engines.

You really don't want a Qashqai - it was sold in the US as "Nissan Rouge" and scotty had a lot of things to say about it, even though in the US they only had it with good engines not a 3 cylinder Renualt.

That 1.2L engine is better known as the Renault H5Ft. I would AVOID that engine like wildfire they're oil burners and an absolute nightmare, it's only luck that will tell how long it will last.

https://www.connexionfrance.com/French-news/French-drivers-take-Renault-to-court-for-alleged-motor-fault-deception

I'd wait to see what the French court says about it before buying one - but word on the street is that they "burn oil faster than you can fill it"...

Also the automatics on these are horrible, a lot of people on this forum have complained and it's very common to see xTronic transmission (Jatco CVTs) in transmission shops.

I'd only get a Diesel (1.5L is the best IMO, but it has a timing belt that needs to be periodically replaced)  manual OR a 2.0L petrol (like what's sold in the US) with a manual.

the rest are junk. (weak DCT transmissions, weak CVT transmissions, weak Turbo engines, ...)

I had a good experience with a Renualt Fluecne (aka. Renault Megane III) 1.5L dCi diesel, But my first car was a Renualt Megane I 1.6L petrol and it was HORRIBLE!

It's a lottery. I would definitely not buy an automatic or a small engine from Renault.

On the topic of noise in the cabin,

I own both a Volvo C30 that's almost silent in the cabin, and a Ford Focus that's very noisy. 

I notice the difference but I just get used to it, and I really don't mind it after a while - for example the car I ordered is considered very noisy but I don't feel like that's an issue. Personally I got used to it after a while.

But if it's an issue to you, then a manual Avensis can be nice - if it's low kilometrage, a mechanic checks it out and it's in good shape, it might be a great car.

Basically I would like to get Toyota Auris/Corolla, but the noisiness is the main obstacle. 

I don't know about Corolla but my Auris is noisy only at highway speeds. Otherwise it is relatively quiet.

Thank you for your answers @dan and @g-t.

On Toyota's

For Corolla E180, the petrol engines available in Finland seem to be 1.3 VVT-i and 1.6, as per research on cars for sale and Finnish Wikipedia. 95% of the cars for sale with 1.6 engine seem to be Valvematic, I could spot only one 1.6 VVT-i based on quick research, so seems to be very scarce. There are also few for sale with 1.33 VVT-i.

For Auris E170, petrol engines available in Finland seem to be 1.2T, 1.3 VVT-i somewhat scarcely, 1.6 Valvematic and hybrid 1.8.

So it seems this 1.8L VVT-i (2ZR-FAE) engine mentioned is not available here at all, and 1.6 VVT-i is very scarce.

For automatic transmission, following engines seem to be available with it:

Auris E170: 1.2T, 1.6 Valvematic, 1.8 Hybrid
Corolla E180: 1.6 Valvematic

What are the main issues with Valvematic engines? I don't ever remember Scotty having a video of them.

What do you think of these 1.8 Hybrid systems? I am aware that hybrid adds lot of complex technology, and can be costy to repair especially when they age. But on the other hand, Toyota makes the most reliable hybrid cars as per my knowledge, although if I am planning to keep the car when it's 5-20 years old, chances are that it's battery should be replaced at some point no matter how well one would take care of it.

It is a small surprise that Toyota's CVT wouldn't be -that- good. In the video below Scotty seems to say he has never experienced Toyota Corolla CVT gone bad (prematurely, maybe?).

Should You Buy a CVT Transmission Car (How It Works) (4:43)

On VW/Skoda

I am naturally aware of the fact that they are not as reliable and durable as Toyota's, but would be mostly tempted to get one because of more silent cabin experience (Golf) or better ergonomics (Octavia). Asked from three different dealers of whether DSG's of that age are still problematic, and all of them said there hasn't been any complaints of them for years, but seems it's not entirely the case. I have read that so-called "dry" DSG's would be the most problematic ones, and "wet" 6 or 7 gear ones a bit better.

A local non-brand mechanic shop spezialized in VAG's said that in general turbochargers in these engines last very well if oil changes are properly made.

For now, I might be compelled to consider some low mileage Skoda/VW with 1.0 TSI engine and manual transmission as an option for Toyota, if 1.0 and 1.2 TSI don't have similar problems than 1.4 and 1.8's?

Am still open for other brand/model suggestions too. Noticed you describe yourself as Volvo enthusiast @dan, do you think Volvo V40 with 1.6L petron engine and manual gearbox could be worth considering? Would most probably be safest option in it's class.

I've had an 2015 Auris E180 Touring Sport Hybrid (100 k km soon) for some months now, and must say I like the car. It seems to be well built, easy to service, drives OK and is surpricingly spacy. Average 0.58 l pr 10 km now in the winter with stud tires. Very easy to drive.

Thank you for all the responses and comments again.

Manual or automatic?

It seems indeed that reliable engine - automatic transmission -combinations are not that common. Looks like Toyota Auris/Corolla with CVT is the only somewhat good option, especially compared to Skoda/VW with DSG.

I am still unsure whether I should choose a car with manual or automatic transmission. I have personally owned only manual cars so far, but the car would be driven by another person who hasn't been driving manual one for years.

It seems that since 2015 Auris facelift, this 1.2T engine has replaced the 1.6 Valvematic one, and most automatic Aurises younger than 2015 are with 1.2T. So the only 1.6 Valvematic - CVT automatic combinations are on Corolla, which is not as commonly available as Auris here.

Diesel

I am generally not considering a car with diesel engine. Here where I live there is annual tax collected from passenger cars powered by diesel engine. Diesel itself is not taxed as heavily, it's in fact much cheaper than gasoline, but in general diesel car is more expensive unless one is driving a lot, depending on a model it can be something like 10,000 - 90,000km a year.

Nissan, Renault and Audi

Ok, I will drop the idea of Nissan Qashqai and Renault. They were kind of long shots anyway.

Yes, I suppose Audi is kind of VW in a fancy suit, and the main feature that would draw me into it would be it's claimed silence. Are these 1.2 / 1.4 TFSI engines basically the same than VW/Skoda TSI -ones? I read somewhere that the only difference between them would be that Audi uses for some reason TFSI instead of TSI abbreviation for it.

I guess Audi goes a bit out of scale here in a sense that it's a premium brand which has higher maintenance costs (or so I have understood) compared to other options.

Cabin noise

On noise, yeah, one gets used to it at least to some degree after a while. My current Toyota corolla E110 is very noisy, but I guess I have got used to it some degree also, but I guess it is still annoying or stressing time to time. Compared to my current car, all the cars I have test-driven are more quiet, both subjectively and based on measurements (decibel meter app on smart phone).

It is kind of important feature, but I guess not as important as reliability. It is not an easy decision at all between these two, and am not sure where I end up to quite honestly.

Requirements

If I narrow down my requirements a bit, so that I wish to have a 5-6 year (2016-2017) model car, with a mileage of max 125,000 km, it would seem that for Toyota, Corolla/Auris - also manual, but especially automatic/hybrid - I should add ~2,000 eur into my budget, but Golf/Octavia I could get with manual gearbox and 1.0 TSI engine driven 60,000 - 100,000 km by 15,000 eur. For Avensis, a price of automatic goes too high, but manual one could be available within ~2,000 eur budget increment.

Well, I think at this point I should do some test drives with those cars, especially Golf manual and Corolla/Auris manual, as I haven't tried them at all so far.

Engines

Found these threads on this site where there seems to be some discussion on the two engines in hand.

Toyota's 1.2 T engines

VW GOLF TSI 1.0, how to care for small engine?

The engine that is most available here in manual Golfs is 1.0 TSI CHZK 63kW / 85hp one, and it seems to come with timing belt as per these two sites.

The camshafts are driven by a toothed belt and installed in the separate camshaft housing attached on top of the cylinder head.

VW/Audi 1.0 TSI EA211 Engine Specs, Problems & Reliability

Volkswagen Golf VII Typ AU (2012 – 2020)

Dual mass flywheel

I have understood VW would have some durability issues with their dual mass flywheels, and that replacing one can be 1000+ euros. Is Corolla/Auris E180/E170 with 1.2T or 1.6 Valvematic engine also equipped with one, or is it only with their diesel engines?